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Peter Martindale

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What Has Happened to Argentine Dignity?

Posted: 20/02/2012 18:45

What a shame it is that Argentina is making rather a fool of itself with its continuing threats against the Falkland Islands.

The British and Argentinians have had a good history together at times. They have much in common and ought to be the best of friends. Polo, rugby, cricket, Harrods, and tea may not be everything but they are bonds tying civilised peoples.

But if they are not going to allow intelligence to guide them but instead rhetoric and become stupid from a desire to impose their imperial ambitions on another people and another country, then a few reminders are in order. The Argentinians are behaving like nineteenth century colonialists in claiming the Falkland Islands from an existing status quo; most state boundaries were settled long ago, including Argentina's; are they now to tear-up the borders of all South and Central American states, and demand new ones?

1) They have greater claim to their neighbouring country Uruguay, than they do to the Falklands. They have fought over Uruguay and previously parts of it have been part of Argentina. Is Argentina going to invade and claim Uruguay or others of its neighbours?

2) Argentine politicians must be pretty desperate for what? to continue to claim the Falklands. Any sensible Argentine statesman would have declared an end to any claims they have on the Falklands, and so have lifted the psychological burden their ongoing claim makes upon the country and people of Argentina, and with it the worry it must give their neighbours as to whether they will be the next to be invaded. Spiritually it has to be better for Argentina to drop such a spurious stance, and move on and develop, instead of holding their people in a backwater.

3) Argentina doesn't even have the remnants of a claim. hat Spain perhaps first found the Falklands and therefore Argentina as the biggest country in Spain's ex-South American territories should thus be the heir to them is flaky; for one thing Spain is not dead but very much still exists! If any country might conceivably have a claim to the Falklands, it would be Spain herself. Spain dropped any claim long ago.

4) Not even Spain claims the Islands, so Argentina certainly has no claim on them.

5) If proximity is the argument, then Argentina beware, as on that basis the USA should be claiming all of South America - and that I do not advocate.

6) Remember, most of the 'Argentinians' who are sabre rattling about the Falklands, were not even Argentinian themselves at the time they relate the claim back to.

7) Are we to now have the spectacle of Argentina championing the USA declaring Cuba to be its fifty-first state, to join New Mexico and California and other states that some Latin Americans seem to think should be part of them instead but which are firmly part of the USA?

8) Maybe the Argentine stance on the Falklands is to somehow salve their guilt that of course they are themselves the colonial oppressors of the indigenous Indian populations of the South Americas, who have no claim on the Falklands. If the immigrants to Argentina wish to continue to claim the Falklands, then the indigenous peoples of the Americas, have a stronger call to claim their lands back.

If the Argentine government continues to seek control of the Falklands instead of concentrating on making Argentina a great country, is it any wonder that Argentina flounders in and out of political and economic quagmires? If Argentina is not self-sufficient spiritually in itself then how is having the Falklands going to release it? And if they think the prospect of oil with solve Argentina's ailments, then history has many times proven that the black gold brings with it many problems.

It saddens me to see such a great people as the Argentines and their beautiful country to be degrading themselves pursuing a spurious claim against their neighbour. I would like to be able to champion what a great nation they are too but unfortunately there has not been a great statesman come forward from amongst the Argentines with the integrity to renounce all claims to the islands.

Imagine if there are the rumoured reserves of oil; whilst Argentina prolongs its own agony with a claim on the Falklands, then she will not benefit from it. The UN cannot possibly support such a claim as it would open the way to tearing up all boundaries around the world and to total chaos and world war. If Argentina drops its claim on the Falklands, then imagine the prosperity that that would bring to Argentinians: the jobs that would be created in Argentina that would result: Argentina is best placed to benefit from a Falklands oil industry; the ships which would need servicing, the chance of the oil being refined on its shores, the workers the country could supply. But how can any of this come the way of the Argentine people whilst there is any claim on the Islands? Argentine politicians are denying prosperity to their own people by declaring that Falkland flagged ships cannot enter her waters. Imagine the fracas if 'Falklands Oil' cannot do business there because of the insistence on the name 'Malvinas'. How can Argentines have jobs on the islands whilst their country still lays claim to the Falklands? It is ordinary Argentines and Argentinian business that will lose out and suffer if their government continues the charade of a claim, just as the Argentine fishing industry loses out now and has for the last thirty years because of stupid politicians ensconced in luxury in Buenos Aires.

It is about time Argentine politicians stood up and said that it is not in Argentina's interest to maintain a claim on the Falklands. It is about time that Argentine politicians stopped raising the hopes of the Argentinian people and conning them that there is a basis for a claim. Is there a politician with such integrity somewhere in Argentina?

The Argentine people should have the intelligence and dignity to drop all claims to the Falklands and so to benefit from improved relations and trade, or for ever be complaining about the state of their own country and what might have been.

 
What a shame it is that Argentina is making rather a fool of itself with its continuing threats against the Falkland Islands. The British and Argentinians have had a good history together at times. ...
What a shame it is that Argentina is making rather a fool of itself with its continuing threats against the Falkland Islands. The British and Argentinians have had a good history together at times. ...
 
 
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02:17 PM on 02/22/2012
Argentina's claim to the Falklands is as good as the natives on whose land their country is built. If the islands are given to Argentina, will they return Pategonia to the natives? Will they be giving reparations to the children of African Slaves? The Falklands are a rock with no native population. If the UK wants to spend millions on supporting a dependent population half way around the world, let them. The Argentine people are better served selling Falkland Islanders provisions. If Argentina still wants to colonize the Falklands, do it like the Americans and invest in the islands with cheaper goods and services. Let the Islanders go to school, travel freely and do business in your country. In one generation all of their children will speak spanish, in 3 generations they will forget how to speak English.
08:00 AM on 02/22/2012
He departed from the Falkland Islands in April 1821. In total he had spent no more than six months on the island, entirely at Port Luis. In 1822, Jewett was accused of piracy by a Portuguese court, but by that time he was in Brazil.

News of Jewett's claim over the Falklands was reported first in the Salem Gazette, a Massachusetts news paper and then re-printed in the Times of London. The Spanish newspaper Cadiz then reported the story and it was only when this report reached Buenos Aires, as a foreign news story, was it published in the Buenos Aires Argos on 10 November 1821. More than a year after the event. The Argentine government itself made no announcements. This was probably because Jewett had made no report of his 'acquisition' and so they were completely unaware that it had taken place.
08:00 AM on 02/22/2012
Many modern authors report this letter as the declaration issued by Jewett.[8] Weddell did not believe that Jewett was acting with the interests of the United Provinces of the River Plate in mind, rather Jewett had merely put into the harbour in order to obtain refreshments for his crew, and that the assumption of possession was chiefly intended for the purpose of securing an exclusive claim to the wreck of the French ship Uranie that had foundered at the entrance of Berkeley Sound a few months prior. Weddell left the islands on 20 November 1820 noting that Jewett had not completed repairs to the Heroína.

Finally Jewett seized an American flagged ship named Rampart, committing piracy for a second time. Jewett sent a long report to Buenos Aires dated 1 February 1821 in which he described his journey. He did not, however, make any mention whatsoever of his claim over the Falklands.
02:56 AM on 02/22/2012
How about Gibraltar, dear Mr. Martindale?
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Peter Martindale
01:17 PM on 03/12/2012
Are you suggesting that Morocco should re-claim both Gibraltar and Spain, dear Silverline?
02:13 AM on 02/22/2012
Dignity is to stand against a powerful bully and tell him who will not hear in the face: we will never give up what we believe is rightfully ours and we will do so peacefully and constant in all multilateral forums and organizations even after you have looted until the last barrel of oil, because we feel the malvinas islands as an integral part of our territory.

If it is getting shameful and uncomfortable for the UK maintain its position, I'm sorry. and send princes, destroyers and submarines with nuclear bombs to a democratic country where armed forces are like a group of Boy Scouts, serve only to show the impotence and lack of arguments that have the UK and show the world what the truth of the situation in the south Atlantic. truth, I'm sure that any British with dignity, knows well.

I am convinced that Argentina is on track to recovery of the island's sovereignty in the Falklands and the United Kingdom of Great Britain that knows this inevitably will happen, should sit at the negotiation table and do it in a dignified manner.
02:58 AM on 02/22/2012
elenano,
Thank you very much for your thoughts. Very much to the point, I could not agree more with your observations.
11:03 AM on 02/22/2012
Another post that fails to consider the basic human rights of Falkland Islanders. . .who exactly is being bullied here again?

Dignity is the state or quality of being worthy of honour or respect, regardless of class, race, gender, nationality, culture, sex, education, religion or any other divisions.

Dignity puts the rights of people over (dubious) territorial claims. National flag-waving, feeling victimised, imposing domineering views, bearing grudges, irresponsibility and manipulation (propaganda) don't qualify I'm afraid.
09:41 PM on 02/22/2012
I do respect every human right of the offspring of the violently established British settlement in Malvinas. If they want to remain British, it is not me who will be against. They deserve it if that's their wish. I would like to find similar respect for the human rights of the Argentinean masses, because having a complete and non occupied land is a human right too, whatever some interests may want to narrow the sense of the concept to. My single request, then, is that the residents in the Falklands remain there if they please, keep British if they please, but that the British Empire gets out of the place, and the Arg flag substitutes the British flag.
01:45 AM on 02/22/2012
The author of this note is poorly informed about the Argentine people, their sense of identity and belonging, as well as the richness and possibilities of their country. Argentina does not need to do business with the Islanders. It is just the other way around, please don´t be cynical. You want oil to be refined offshore? it is your business! you need workers? get them from the UK. You need hospital and university training? Send all of your fellow islanders to study to the UK and pay for it. And so on. Mr. Martindale, I am afraid, you are projecting most of your problems back home in the Uk to what you assume the Argentine people needs. We prefer to do business with Chine! And you take care of your islanders!
12:40 AM on 02/22/2012
The story is simple, the islands were discovered in 1550 by a Español.En 1790 the British Government signed a treaty which declared the islands Spanish property! In 1820 the Argentina occupy the islands with 150 civilians Argentinos. in 1833 a British captain, using "the reason for the weapons," drive out all the Argentines on the islands! Want to talk about self-determination? Ask the descendants of the 150 Argentine expelled! Who gave the right to occupy the British government the islands? The "right" of weapons is a "right"? Very civilized indeed!
05:35 PM on 02/22/2012
you do know that this version is just Peronist propaganda, don't you?
Those 'expelled' were a military garrison composed mainly of ex- convicts, previously commanded by a Frenchman, and who had recently murdered their own officer. About 30 i think, not 150. And the civilians to whom you refer? Far from being driven out, They were asked to remain, but hating the place, and unsupplied by the Argentine govt hence half-starving, refused to stay on and so were returned at their own request.

But please, don't allow facts to colour your views....
06:28 PM on 02/22/2012
Mr. Swissian, to begin with, me who is not Peronist asks you what the hell you mean by "Peronist propaganda", when Argentina has been claiming against the British occupation ever since 1833? And, on the other side, we Argentineans have seen what has brought to our country the overthrow of Perón. It has brought nothing but backwardness, blood and destruction. And, BTW and as a last point, I guess the Australian settlement should be elliminated because the whole place started as an overseas prison, not to speak of the so many criminals that were exported by England to North America before 1776
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The modern GOP would have hated TR, Lincoln & Ike
03:05 PM on 02/28/2012
Thank you! It's nice to have another person on here that has read a history book not filled with propaganda cooked up in the 30s and incorporated into Argentine textbooks in the 40s.
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03:16 AM on 02/28/2012
A very simplified version with far too many of the details conveniently ironed out, you must be a regular Wikipedia user...
05:12 PM on 02/21/2012
Mr. Peter Martindale: I've read this article and I can only say one thing: FANTASTIC. I'm an argentine man ashamed of being argentine. In fact, if you watch my comments on Twitter you'll se what I mean. Argentina has nothing to do with Falklands and less in this case where this "conflict" is used to cover internal problems. Thanks.
01:49 AM on 02/22/2012
Dear Fellow citizen, you are wrongly assuming that there is a great difference between Mr. Cameron and Ms. Kirchner in this regard. This is wrong. The UK is currently undergoing great difficulties as everyone in EU knows.Sincerely, I am not sure England is much better off than Argentina, not even in rugby, not in Polo, and not in natural resources for sure. The only hope for England is to stick on their old fading colonial remains.
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The modern GOP would have hated TR, Lincoln & Ike
03:08 PM on 02/28/2012
What a relief! An educated Argentinian! Thank you!
01:01 PM on 03/01/2012
Someone must have said in London, on the same line, "What a relief! An educated colonial! Benedict Arnold, thank you!"