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Felicity A Morse

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No Such Thing as a Non-Believer

Posted: 28/10/2012 23:00

No one's religious anymore. Not anyone with any sense. Religion incites hatred, starts wars, and vilifies anyone who challenges its narrow-minded views. Believing in a big bearded man in the sky is stupid. I can say and do what I want because when I die I'm either going to be burnt or rot in the ground. That's it. Finito, terminado, kthanksbye.

Of course I'm playing devil's advocate. There are still lots of people who consider themselves religious in Britain and these beliefs should be respected not ridiculed.

Yet there is a increasing portion of society who consider those with religious faith to be foolish, irrational or responsible for ostracising others. Religious beliefs are all too often either mocked or resentfully tolerated.

But having faith is not as alien a concept as atheists might suggest.

The gap between believers and non believers doesn't exist in the way that some people insist.

It is true that we all believe in something. And those beliefs are often fundamental to our view of the world and something we resolutely adhere to even when challenged.

We all have beliefs and through acknowledging this, some of the tension between religious and secular parts of society can be healed. Indeed our very need to believe unites us.

Belief means an acceptance that something is true, especially an acceptance without proof.

It also means having trust or confidence in something. Faith pretty much means the same thing (according to the Oxford English Dictionary) except it's defined in stronger terms.

We believe in lots of things without proof. Even if we don't use the word faith, we put our confidence in people or actions with no guarantee of whether they will work.

Loving someone is an incredible act of faith for example. Virgil wrote in 42 BC: "Love conquers all things; let us too surrender to love."

That was way before Christianity took off in the ancient world. Even those heathen Romans had some conception of faith. It's almost impossible to live your life believing in nothing.

Looking after our planet implies a set of beliefs about humanity too. After all, we will be reduced to dust before the world heats up, the ice caps melt and the mango becomes the national fruit of Scotland. It will be a shame but it's not like we'll be around to see it.

Yet lots of secular people care about the planet. Why? Are we trustees of its "still waters and green pastures"? Who trusted it to us then?

We should preserve the planet for our fellow creatures goes one argument. Perhaps we have a responsibility to the other human beings who come after us.

But that implies some sort of belief about the whole of humanity. And seeing as none of us have met the whole of humanity, that's a hell of a leap of faith in the worthiness of humans.

Perhaps you believe most people are fundamentally good, so we should protect the planet for them.

If you think we should "treat others the way you want to be treated" and seeing as we like to live in a green and pleasant land we should allow our descendants the privilege too.

Many people believe in the 'do unto others as you would to yourselves' maxim. It is also an ethic that underpins almost every religion from East to West. If you believe in that, you have something in common with every Muslim, Christian, Jew and Hindu in Britain today.

In Islam it is expressed implicitly and explicitly both in the Koran and the hadith, sayings of the prophet Muhammad. "That which you want for yourself, seek for mankind."

In Hinduism the ethic is embodied in the sacred text of the Mahabharata: "One should never do that to another which one regards as injurious to one's own self."

The maxim "Love your neighbour as yourself "is enshrined in both the Jewish Torah and Christian Old Testament

These religions are not breaking new ground with their adoption of the 'golden rule.'

"Never impose on others what you would not choose for yourself," wrote Confucius around 500BC.

Maybe this maxim is just a common sense practice for a decent society. Still, to hold true it requires a level of belief.

You're trusting that the person to whom you ascribe this maxim is like you.

Which requires a belief that in some way humans are similar. If you are like me, and I am like you, and I am thinking about you then you must also sometimes think about me. And we are both probably deserving of respect.

Even if you think the maxim has survived due to a selfish desire to preserve oneself, the very fact so many people believe it to be true shows we have more in common than we realise: ironically, regardless of all our different beliefs.

There's nothing wrong with belief, secular or religious. In and of itself, undistorted, it's not the dangerous force that it's sometimes labelled.

In fact, it takes a level of courage and self confidence to trust in something. I think perhaps we are all more inclined to believe than we realise. So even if our faiths are different, as believing humans we still have quite a lot in common. That sounds like a pretty good starting point for understanding and believing in each other to me.

 
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No one's religious anymore. Not anyone with any sense. Religion incites hatred, starts wars, and vilifies anyone who challenges its narrow-minded views. Believing in a big bearded man in the sky is st...
No one's religious anymore. Not anyone with any sense. Religion incites hatred, starts wars, and vilifies anyone who challenges its narrow-minded views. Believing in a big bearded man in the sky is st...
 
 
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
crjslick50
05:42 PM on 11/04/2012
I stll believe in the old saying : There are no atheists in foxholes
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hearthammer
If left is right and right is wrong, decide!
09:23 PM on 11/04/2012
As someone who has actually seen combat, I can honestly tell you that most combatants do not cry for a god, they cry for their mothers!
04:30 PM on 11/04/2012
If these atheists and secularists are so much against religions, why don't they oppose, let's say Christmas and Easter too? No, they wouldn't because they want to enjoy themselves during Christmas and Easter and/or Eid. It is of benefit to them. But when it comes to the religion itself, they claim that it promotes violence, it's full of fairytales, that it is intolerant.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Thismortalcoil
Science is the poetry of reality
05:44 PM on 11/04/2012
You need to do your research, there were widely celebrated festivals at Christmas and Easter time long before Christians took them over.
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hearthammer
If left is right and right is wrong, decide!
09:25 PM on 11/04/2012
Exactly! The Xtians imported the old pagan festivals in order to confuse the locals, wherever they were!
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Mneme
The truth shall make ye fret.
11:42 PM on 11/04/2012
Merry Saturnalia!
12:17 PM on 11/04/2012
Some religions encourage love of all. Some encourage love of some. One encourages hatred of many.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Prickly Herbert
Mine's a large gin
10:10 PM on 10/31/2012
What muddled thinking. I may have faith for example, that someone I entrust to remember to bring in a pint of milk on the way home will deliver, but it doesn't bring me any closer to the religious who I imagine may also harbour the same domestic hopes on occasion.
'Religious beliefs are all too often either mocked or resentfully tolerated' well the religious probably have nobody to blame but themselves for that one. Arrogance and intolerances rarely go unpunished. Mocking and resentful toleration are rarely fatal btw.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Prickly Herbert
Mine's a large gin
09:45 AM on 11/01/2012
I meant to add .......unless the religious take offence.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Dombeyandson
05:41 PM on 10/31/2012
Surely you are confusing religion and belief - the two are quite different. Religion is the practise that makes man feel better with his God whereasa faith is God finding man. religion is simply a way of life and we do certain things religiously in thehope tehy will give us comfort and a unity with the Almighty. Dressing up in funny clothes, not eating this or that or fasting [which is intended to bring our mind closer to God as we become weaker and halucinate so after a 40 day fast well. Today we believe we are more powerful and better infromed that religion is not for everyone but Faith - that's another matter. faith is to believe in what we hope for and whils there are many, many experts around they don't realy know if faith works but it might do for them. Surely early believers had a much tougher time when faced with th reality of troture for their faith and being forced to believe when very often teaching was in a language barely anyone knew. Bsides 2000 yearws on and the Church still hasn't cottoned on that the true message certainly from Christ was not religion but faith.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
crjslick50
05:43 PM on 11/04/2012
Actually, pot seems to bring a sense of spiritual awareness. I think that may be why it's illegal.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
astralady
04:38 PM on 10/31/2012
I dont believe as the bible is just another fairytale book.If i was to say that there`s fairies at the bootom of my garden then you would say she`s nuts and shoul be locked away.They always say that god is with us everywhere we go if so why is he causeing so much trouble.when i see him then i might beleive
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
OH72
10:23 AM on 11/04/2012
If you believe people should be locked away for stating that there's fairies at the bottom of their garden, it's you who should be locked away. There's a huge difference between believing strange things and being a danger to the public.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
astralady
06:10 PM on 11/04/2012
.I`m passing a comment just like anyone else does.the only difference is i dont go saying things to people like you are saying to me
01:42 PM on 10/31/2012
Interesting article, thought provoking ideas. But wrong. I'm an educated, professional, white English engineer. But for over 40 years have spent most of my life working worldwide. I have enjoyed the generous and appreciated, off-site company of, and conversation with, professional Moslems, Buddhists, Communists, Jews, and even hard line American Christians. And Atheists - like me. I envy religious people (any religion). How sweet it must be to have faith in the face of undeniable evidence that you are wrong. But sleep happy. As I will, confident that when I die, by my own hand, and at a time of my own choosing, that's it. Silence. A thought that comforts me.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
OH72
10:24 AM on 11/04/2012
"How sweet it must be to have faith in the face of undeniable evidence that you are wrong."

May you provide such evidence, I mean evidence that a specific religion is plain wrong.

I don't think you understand that "evidence" thing, but then that's to be expected - as an engineer, you're trained to apply knowledge, not to assess its validity.
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hearthammer
If left is right and right is wrong, decide!
09:28 PM on 11/04/2012
There is absolutely no evidence of the supernatural. If you believe that there is, i would urge you to cite it and you may actually win £1m!
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Mneme
The truth shall make ye fret.
11:55 PM on 11/04/2012
I am also strongly considering taking my life in the future, though as a 26 year old I do not anticipate doing so for another 40 years at least. It surprises me how few people ever consider it a viable option.
12:30 PM on 10/31/2012
Ohh no, I'm 'pending' again.!!
Kraptonfactor
They're coming to take me away ha ha, hee hee, ho
01:51 PM on 10/31/2012
@ Mafreeman
I have an ointment for that if you want to borrow it? :-)
06:12 PM on 10/31/2012
The Huff strikes again!
Will they never allow any thoughts from us readers who have an opinion, that does not sit too well with them, to get past the censor?
Are the powers that be scared of a non-religious persons arguements?
Fed up with this scaredy cat joke of a forum!
This comment has been removed.
10:33 AM on 10/31/2012
Im a total athiest but I believe that everyone has the right to believe in what ever they want wether you are christian muslim jewish or a Jedi Knight.
What I dont believe is that any religion should try and force themselves or there beliefs on anyone.
Come the day I die and im wrong and there is a god then I alone will have to answer to him,other than that I will be buried or cremated and life will go on.
To be honest all that is needed is one of these gods to appear only for a second and point a finger and say BEHAVE and we would all have no choice but to believe,but qas usuall the silence is defening.
This comment has been removed.
10:29 AM on 10/31/2012
If religion were kept on a personal level, in the churches / mosques etc and not on the streets then I don't think the world in general would care one iota who believes what. I have no leanings to any deity of any kind, but when you say that to a person of religious beliefs they automatically try to tell you why you are wrong ! Just keep it to yourselves, and we can all live in peace !
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Thismortalcoil
Science is the poetry of reality
03:36 PM on 10/31/2012
Agreed!
We need separation of church and state. There is no good reason why we as taxpayers should be having to pay for 26 unelected bishops in the House of Lords.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
LadyRokujo
05:23 PM on 10/31/2012
Agreed from me too. People have every right to believe what they like in private, but the minute they start shoving it in others faces that's when all the problems start. As long as they abide by the law and don't do anybody else any harm then peoples religion is their own business, but it has no place in ANYTHING that receives one penny of the taxpayers money. Be that the House of Lords, schools, or anything else in the public domain.
It's a great pity no government is likely to ever have the balls to turn around & put it into practice.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
OH72
10:26 AM on 11/04/2012
"I have no leanings to any deity of any kind, but when you say that to a person of religious beliefs they automatically try to tell you why you are wrong ! Just keep it to yourselves, and we can all live in peace !"

Bullshit. The vast majority of people of religious belief are in no way missionary. And as long as you reserve for yourself the right to smear others in public, kindly desist from complaining when they reciprocate.
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hearthammer
If left is right and right is wrong, decide!
09:32 PM on 11/04/2012
You don't have to be a missionary to talk rubbish!
12:44 PM on 11/05/2012
Just like you're doing? Bazinga...
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
nailer6327
this life is nothing but a freemasons get together
09:48 AM on 10/31/2012
think i will take a slow walk to the fish market and see if there is any lamb chops on offer..
09:09 AM on 10/31/2012
If you never believe in anything you will never be disappointed.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Dombeyandson
05:42 PM on 10/31/2012
Try believeing in yourself??
02:15 AM on 10/31/2012
Because we believe in some things without actually having personal experience of them, somehow that means religious belief is also acceptable? I'm afraid that doesn't work. There has to be an element of common sense involved when we decide whether or not to believe something e.g. is it likely?, is it physically possible? is there any scientific evidence to back it up? Religion is the opposite, it is a man-made invention, providing bogus solutions to questions that are difficult to answer. If any of it was actually true, it would become part of physical science and subject to the same laws as everything else, so the 'spiritual' part would cease to exist anyway. Instead religion sits outside of logical thought and can only continue to exist by the indoctrination of the next generation, and by denying that any scientific laws apply to it. Why would any reasonable 'god' require their subjects to have faith, to pray?, what exactly is the point?, why place doubt in anyone's mind in the first place?, why not just reveal yourself to all, then there's no problem? It's all complete nonsense.
This user has chosen to opt out of the Badges program
08:34 AM on 10/31/2012
Read through your missive. The whole script is based on belief. Without it you would have nothing to write about at all. How do you actually know, that anything you have stated as fact, is either true or untrue.? We all have belief. How you interpret it is up to you alone. Disbelief is a belief in itself.
Science is so often proven wrong. The 10 commandments, if obeyed, would result in peace and harmony. Sadly man cannot live up to those expectations. Do you know who wrote them? Of course not.
10:36 AM on 10/31/2012
Ahh yes, the 10 commandments. The first four are simply irrelevant to peace and harmony, and the other six miss out such important things such as sexism, racism, slavery, rape within marriage or by a unmarried man.In fact the bible provides a convenient get-out to a rapist:
"If a man happens to meet a virgin who is not pledged to be married and rapes her and they are discovered, he shall pay the girl's father fifty shekels of silver. He must marry the girl, for he has violated her. He can never divorce her as long as he lives." -Deuteronomy 22:28-29
12:57 PM on 10/31/2012
wixies, which part of "There has to be an element of common sense involved when we decide whether or not to believe something" didn't you understand? Disbelief is a belief in itself? - what does that mean? I believe the solid evidence from what we have already discovered in science, that's not to say there aren't many things we don't understand yet. Religious 'belief' is totally different, religions were invented to fill the void in understanding by people who wanted solutions rather than more questions, isn't that fairly obvious?
08:45 AM on 10/31/2012
Agreed. Richard Dawkins for PM!.
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hearthammer
If left is right and right is wrong, decide!
09:35 PM on 11/04/2012
Oh, got to agree with you there!

F&F!!!
01:00 AM on 10/31/2012
Really sad, my first ever comment on huffingtonpost was not "allowed" It was on-topic and had some truth behind it, maybe that's why. I'll keep trying, maybe it will go through.

Religion is like a dictatorship, a "higher being" set the rules and if you don't obey, you are punished. Isn't most wars recently has been about getting rid of dictators? While killing each other in the process.
11:01 AM on 10/31/2012
Christianity has its issues but the principle is that its about a partnership rather than a dictatorship. The point is that unless everyone looks out for each other then it results in disharmony. Too many people claim that religion should be about fear of doing wrong when they should be speaking about the need for forgiveness and non judgement of others actions.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Thismortalcoil
Science is the poetry of reality
03:15 PM on 10/31/2012
Try telling that to all the Christians who are trying to stop gay people from having equal rights.