Lib Dem Activists Rebel Over NHS Reform Bill Motion

Nhs Vote Lib Dem Spring Conference

PA/The Huffington Post   First Posted: 11/03/2012 10:44 Updated: 11/03/2012 11:32

Liberal Democrat activists have defied their party's leadership by refusing to back the controversial NHS Reform Bill at their spring conference in Gateshead.

The motion not to compel Peers to back the Health and Social Care Bill during its final stages in Parliament was passed by 314 votes to 217.

Although the vote is not binding on the Lords, it is highly embarrassing for Nick Clegg, who will face accusations that he is acting contrary to the wishes of the majority of his own party by supporting Andrew Lansley's reforms.

The vote also highlights how the party is increasingly divided over its role within the coalition, with some newspaper reports on Sunday suggesting the fractures go right to the top of the leadership.

The vote on Sunday puts the party in a form of policy limbo, coming a day after the Clegg managed to avoid a more severe crisis within his party. A move to vote on a motion calling for the Bill to be dropped entirely was defeated, but only under the quirk of the party's Alternative Vote system, used when deciding Lib Dem policy.

St Ives MP Andrew George insisted the party could not go on "deluding" itself, saying: "Substantial opposition has still been mounting in spite of these changes.

"We cannot claim the Bill has been hugely changed.

"I don't want to be apologising in years to come," he added.

Former MP Evan Harris, who was behind the successful bid to amend the motion, told conference that despite the "sincere efforts" made in the House of Lords to reform the Bill it still did not contain a block on the wholesale outsourcing of commissioning work.

"It is still nowhere near the coalition agreement," he added.

Rachel Coleman Finch, a party member from Cambridge, told conference the politics of the bill were "poisonous".
"We are screwed if we pass it and we are screwed if we don't," she said.

"We need to get away from a macho fear of u-turns."

Dr Ann Morrison, from Birmingham, argued if the party had stuck to the Coalition agreement "it would not be in this position now".

She added: "You should never turn supporting a bad Bill into a political testosterone and virility test."

On a straight vote on Saturday campaigners against the NHS shake-up won enough support yesterday to have their "kill the Bill" emergency motion debated. But, under the party's alternative vote system, they lost out to the "Shirley Williams motion" on second preferences.

The legislation was "paused" after the party's spring conference last year amid a furious backlash. It has since been amended more than 1,000 times, but many prominent health organisations remain fiercely opposed to the plans Mr Clegg insists activists will be "comforted" by the scale of the changes to the original Bill.

But he admitted his biggest lesson as leader had been the failure to convey the argument on NHS reforms.

He said: "I tell you one thing I have learnt on what could be handled better.

"I have learnt, and frankly I've learnt it the hard way over the last year and a half, you can't spring on to the public a solution or a policy if you don't spend a lot of time first explaining what the problem is.

"If we had spent more time explaining that simply having more and more people going to hospital for an increasingly long period of time is just not a sustainable way to run a good healthcare system...

"Maybe we should have spent time showing people there is a problem, because if you don't show them there is a problem first, why should people accept that there is a need for a solution?

"So I suppose that's the main lesson I've learnt."

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Liberal Democrat activists have defied their party's leadership by refusing to back the controversial NHS Reform Bill at their spring conference in Gateshead. The motion not to compel Peers to bac...
Liberal Democrat activists have defied their party's leadership by refusing to back the controversial NHS Reform Bill at their spring conference in Gateshead. The motion not to compel Peers to bac...
 
 
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11:37 AM on 04/13/2012
Why is no one talking revolution? If a Government is unaccountable to its people, and there is no affective difference in choice between the "various" political parties, then what the hell are we left with? Surely it's a not-so-cleverly masquerading dictatorship? Inherited by each successive generation of politicians, all with similar ideals, all becoming more and more corrupt each passing decade as multi-billion pound companies gain ever increasing amounts of political influence. It makes me feel physically sick just thinking about this.

We are a nation that tolerates. To our credit this is can be a great thing; London simply wouldn't work otherwise. But, this is one time we should not be patiently queuing in a line, keeping quiet and going a long with injustice. This is a time to rise up. We need to stop this media-born political apathy in its tracks, be proud of democracy and listen to each other again. It's got to start somewhere right?
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pepekitch
04:46 PM on 03/12/2012
He is the master of his own down fall, no sympathy for him,he as shown his true blue colours.
lastpost
see biography
12:51 PM on 03/12/2012
"highly embarrassing for Nick Clegg, who will face accusations that he is acting contrary to the wishes of the majority of his own party"
It is difficult to believe that a vote of confidence in the veracity of these promises was not forthcoming. Especially when the tuition fee commitment, honoured so comprehensively, is still fresh in the minds of many.

"some newspaper reports on Sunday suggesting the fractures go right to the top of the leadership."
Any mention of a coup, to replace Nick with Vince?

"We are screwed if we pass it and we are screwed if we don't," she said."
Try new improved Referendum. Guaranteed to remove all traces of blame relating to political incompetence/self interest.

"under the party's alternative vote system, they lost out to the "Shirley Williams motion" on second preferences."
Hoist by one’s own AVS.

"It has since been amended more than 1,000 times."
Maybe the flaw is in the designers.

"Maybe we should have spent time showing people there is a problem"
If you think the people can’t see what the problem is, then the difficulty is caused by underestimating others. For example, how much did the computer debacle waste?
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casual agent
Advocate for social justice
01:40 PM on 03/12/2012
Hoist by one's own Alternative Vote System'...Oh' yes you've hit the nail right on the head there'...Well Said'..Just goes to show what a complete disasaster the AV debacle could have been...You know'..The one principal' they sold out our youngsters for?...and now his So-Called pricipaled stance on the NHS'...I would hazzard a guess'..that a lot more of the Libdems' would like shot of this flawed Tory policy'...I would say most of them'..though they dare'nt not raise their heads above the parapet...Trouble is'..they might feel obliged to carry out the Tories' dirty work'as tey have recieved £1 Million pounds from Private Health Firms' since 2006'...Well before talk of any Coalition'..Which Nails' another lie'That they are in Coalition for the reasons' of stability..Political Expediency Methinks?
10:36 AM on 03/12/2012
The NHS would infact have plenty of money if it was not for the fact that a very large percentage of Tax Payers Money is used to pay Private Companies that are already ripping off the NHS. E.g. The Private Companies that provide medicines to the NHS. The Owners of these private companies are multi billionaires. Whilst they have several mansions, yachts and live in sheer luxury - the Tax Payer is on a long waiting list to receive diagnosis and treatment. We really don't want any more privatisation in the NHS - it will just mean that even more of Tax Payers money is being used to buy another Mansion for the Private Company Directors. Also, some NHS Managers are being paid too much.
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casual agent
Advocate for social justice
03:49 PM on 03/12/2012
Exactly'...Well Said..
ZEB
never fear the zeb is ere
09:59 AM on 03/12/2012
When you take avery good look at this bill, it is not worth the paper it is printed on.
As Paul K says of the NYT, the maths just do not add up.
The tory goverment wants to let 49% of the NHS to go private and the money will be but back into the NHS, looks very fine on paper.
So the elderly will end up saleing their homes just for hospital treatment because they are in great pain, this reminds you of the USA system, if you are rich they have the best system in the world, if you are middle class,or poor you can go to health fair, yes I said health fair for free.
Even then most pepole, that go to these fairs, need hospital treatment, which is impossable because they cannot aford the fees
These private firms will cherry pick what can make them money and the public part will have to pick up the slack.
Just to remind you the NHS belongs to the people of the UK, thats why we pay NI, that is meant to cover the cost of the NHS.
Its not a thing of the goverment of the day, as share holders we must be able to have our say.
08:03 AM on 03/12/2012
Why would anyone take the gibbering of Shirley W seriously. She Ratted on the Labour Party, Sold the SDP down the river and now wants to give the LibDems to the Tories. What next an alliance with the BNP?
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casual agent
Advocate for social justice
03:52 PM on 03/12/2012
Oh' you're so right'...Yes she would rat on anyone just to keep her jabbering voice heard...The Multi-Faced Barroness..lol
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NOSHER
08:01 AM on 03/12/2012
its time time tjey wre all voted out but how can we do it i think everyone has had enough but please dont vote labour iether
08:00 AM on 03/12/2012
WELL DONE! Some spine at last!
07:56 AM on 03/12/2012
The painful process of developing a spine and some b*lls has started fot the LibDems. Not before time but welcome none the less. All they have to do is get rid of Creepy Clegg and his gang of traitors and they will be able to reclaim the once proud Party from oblivion. WELL DONE
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casual agent
Advocate for social justice
03:58 PM on 03/12/2012
...But not quite enough spine yet'...The NHS' is on the critical list'...If we want to keep Health' free at the point of access'..We must fight'..as the Late Great' Nye Bevan' said'..The Health Service will last as long as the people are ready to fight for it'.....That is the question'...Are we willing to fight for the NHS..?
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
whapgra
02:12 AM on 03/12/2012
just plroves tory and libdems dont care about what the people think...ive started an e- petition on the govt web site to get a vote of no confidance in this government. and if i get the100,000 signatures I bet the government will still ignore it like those who objected to the NHS changes, but we have to try.
10:12 PM on 03/11/2012
No wonder Alex Salmond thinks he has the people behind him to get rid of the 3 useless parties we have in Britain.People think they have a better chance with him, and its understandable ,even if you are not an s.n.p supporter ,you do wonder if he may be better.
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casual agent
Advocate for social justice
11:24 PM on 03/11/2012
No'...esp if he wants to get in bed with Murdoch' also....Been there...done that...Some might say Mmm?
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Allyb999
02:38 AM on 03/12/2012
Think you might find it was Murdoch who support Salmond not the other way round, but hey don't let facts could your view.
10:07 PM on 03/11/2012
CLEGG YOU ARE A SCAB TO GO ALONG WITH THE TORYS,YOU WILL NEVER BE IN POWER NOW AND YOU RUINED THE LIB DEMS CHANCES FOR EVER.
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casual agent
Advocate for social justice
11:24 PM on 03/11/2012
Agreed..
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
George McAulay
Delighted to meet you
09:14 PM on 03/11/2012
I thank my stars that I emigrated to Australia.

The successful country I left has been destroyed by all three sides of politics
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casual agent
Advocate for social justice
09:46 PM on 03/11/2012
You lucky Beggar lol....You couldn't smuggle me aboard could you?....I won't 'take up much room....Best of luck to ya...I have relatives in Western Australia too...God on ya bonza Bruce..lol
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Lord Justice Wolf
08:28 PM on 03/11/2012
Why does Cleggy say "he doesn't want to be apologising in years to come" He won't be seen in years to come as he will have earned his money and moved to a warmer climate like all the other tw..s?
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casual agent
Advocate for social justice
09:50 PM on 03/11/2012
Absolutely'....You won't see him for dust'...Talk about Cut n' Run eh?
05:07 AM on 03/12/2012
Earned his money???????? i think you mean got his money
08:25 PM on 03/11/2012
I'm afraid your reporting is wrong. The delegates didn't rebel - they actually voted to support the motion supporting the NHS bill. They simply voted to amend it to delete the part compelling their peers and MPs to vote for it in parliament.
They didn't however vote to compel them to vote for it.
It could be argued they managed to vote to not support the bill and to support it at the same time!
But it would be more truthful to say they voted to support it.
08:57 PM on 03/11/2012
True. And the reform bill has not been altered at all by the lib Dem. Its all a big con as you will all shortly find out.