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Talking to Women: There's a Time and a Place

Posted: 08/10/2012 00:00

It is 1am. I've just walked home alone from the train station nearest to my house.

On my way home, three men approached me.

- The first walked parallel to me from the station to the pedestrian crossing. He asked me if I would like any company. I ignored him, and he acted as if I'd backhanded his mother.

- The second pulled up beside me in a silver Aston Martin with blacked out windows, rolled down his window and asked if I would like a lift. I politely declined. His car hovered at the pavement for a moment, and then he drove away.

- The third shouted to me from the opposite side of the road, 'Hello, darling! How are you?' Again, I offered no response. I walked the long way home to avoid crossing the road towards him.

Tonight, three things happened to me that should never have happened. Would you like me to point out what they were, or can you draw your own conclusions?

Look, I'm going to point out what they were. I'm suitably annoyed, and I have the day off tomorrow. I have nothing to lose.

OK.

The first bad thing that happened to me was the first man approaching me. Unless a woman is upset, in danger, or instigates a conversation, there is absolutely no justifiable reason for speaking to her when she is alone, and resolutely walking home, in the early hours of the morning. Where do you think I'm walking home from that would incite such a desperate need for someone to talk to? My husband's grave? A late night meeting with my parole officer? No?

I'd imagine you took one look at me and realised I'd been out with my friends. And you don't think that maybe if I needed some company I'd have enlisted the help of one of the perfectly capable friends that I already have? That if I was so desperate to be walked home, I wouldn't have, hm, I don't know, asked someone I already know to do the honours? That would be sensible, now you come to think of it. Thought so. And newsflash! I've never made any friends by striking up conversations with random people at 1 o'clock in the morning on a notoriously dangerous East London street. Remember your thinking cap? Where did you leave it?

The second bad thing was the winner of the Hackney Heroin Dealing Award for Exceptional Earning 2010 rocking up beside me and asking me if I'd like to get in his smackmobile and go for a spin. His exact words, I believe, being, 'Alright, beautiful. S'raining, how 'bout I give you a ride home in the Aston?'

How 'bout you give who a ride where in the what now? Me, a ride home? Amazing. So, you're proposing that I get in your £100,000 car, which, by the way, you're driving in circles around a housing estate whilst wearing an Ellesse tracksuit, and that I then give you and your sat-nav my home address and postcode, so that presumably you can let yourself into my flat and dump my body in the bedroom when you're finished with it, making the whole thing look like an inside job?

Listen, pal. My mum raised me with two rules: never to swear and never to get in a car with strangers. In light of the second rule, I think she'd forgive me for breaking the first and saying that when it comes to your offer of the James Bond experience all the way home, I'd rather sh*t in my hands and clap.

The third thing that shouldn't have happened to me this evening is the third man. He was the least strange, but had it just been the two experiences, I'd be sleeping like a baby right now, albeit having double locked the door. Instead, man number three raised his ugly head, shouting at me from fifteen metres away. 'ALRIGHT, DARLING?' he'd repeatedly bellow, 'HOW ARE YOU?' He was standing in between me and my house. I didn't want to cross the road, lest he assumed it was some kind of come on, a sort of 'maybe I'm not speaking to you, but I'm moving my body closer ;) ;) ;) '(which sounds like a lyric from Christina Aguilera's Stripped album. Love that album. Damn.) Anyway, I wasn't going to risk it.

When I eventually got home, I checked every single room. I mean, there's no way anyone could ever get in here (definitely just looked over my shoulder as I typed that) but I was so wound up by that point that it seemed totally justifiable to kick down the bathroom door whilst brandishing a rolling pin in self defence. (Precious housemate, I am sorry about that dent in the wall. Adrenaline. I'll get some Polyfiller tomorrow.)

Maybe all those men I met tonight had honourable intentions. Maybe the first guy was a vicar, doing God's work, and perhaps I appear in a constant state of terrible distress, when actually I'm just thinking about how much I love noodles. Maybe the second was a disillusioned trust fund baby with a penchant for retro tracksuits, who buys expensive cars to feel close to his father, and who lost a younger sister due to wet-weather induced pneumonia. Maybe the third was an autistic and slightly deaf widower, who feels lonely all the time and wanders the streets trying to find someone to talk to.

See, all of those possibilities would be enough to make me feel like a terrible person... if the following wasn't an indisputable, concrete fact.

Less than 150 years ago, a succession of women were sexually assaulted, stabbed, and gutted on streets a moments walk from mine by a killer who was never caught. Alright, so there's some time and a fork in career path between myself and the women whose uteruses Jack the Ripper removed, but the issue is this: men have raped and murdered women at night time in this area for time untold.

I'm of the opinion that, in 2012, I should be able to walk home from a night out without thinking about the prostitutes who were brutalised around the corner in days gone by. Please don't introduce yourself to me at 1am and put them at the forefront of my mind.

 
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It is 1am. I've just walked home alone from the train station nearest to my house. On my way home, three men approached me. - The first walked parallel to me from the station to the pedestrian cross...
It is 1am. I've just walked home alone from the train station nearest to my house. On my way home, three men approached me. - The first walked parallel to me from the station to the pedestrian cross...
 
 
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HUFFPOST BLOGGER
Ellie Slee
12:56 AM on 10/09/2012
Hi saidndunova,

It's always interesting when blogs I write spark debate, so thanks for your comments.

Regarding your idea that I am a victim of my own fear: you're absolutely right, I am. What you fail to pick up on is that I am wholly justified to be afraid when approached by a man I don't know. My best friend was sexually assaulted on her way to work three months ago, two minutes from home. That's not an ego boost, it's a violation. Any woman will tell you that.

I'm not ungrateful because I declined a lift with somebody I don't know. I'm sensible. In a city where the police force advise women not to get into taxis that haven't been pre-booked, getting into a car with a random man would be seen as asking to be hurt.

Normally, I wouldn't bother replying to you at all, but I just clicked on your comment history and read your frankly revolting take on rape. You recently commented on a post regarding the Julian Assange rape case saying that 'The fact something made a person feel bad should not be the criteria for making it a crime.'

I imagine if one of the three men I met on Friday had attacked me, you'd be the first to stand up and say I either enjoyed or deserved it. You might call me a worm, but girls have a far worse word for men like you.

Thanks for your time!

Ellie
11:35 PM on 10/10/2012
You are welcome.. however I will ask that you please don’t just make things up; my comment was in-fact “Quite. Why that’s like saying.. Women shouldn’t be allowed to judge as their guided more by emotion than reason" and then did you happen to notice the content of the message to which that was a reply.. it was my little lame attempt at sarcasm directed in response to another little lame hypocritical girl.. I never once stated your implication. Thank you.

Plus it is a fact that men are more likely to be assaulted. That shouldn’t be an argument, or an excuse. Believe me sweetie, morally there isn’t a ‘worser’ type of violent crime. It is the perpetrator that should be punished. Not you.

Lol n I’m sorry, I thought about being more polite, but it didn’t really seem worth it ;p what you failed to notice is that you are blaming the decent ones, who really did only care. the ones you are so scared about, don’t care what you say or feel.. and sorry if I wasted your time forgive me, but it seems it is your well-being affected, at least im glad you do realise it. may I make a suggestion..

Next time just say ‘no, thank you..’ simple. Smile, take the compliment and everyone gets the ego. No-one is to ‘blame’, and obviously it will make you feel better.. :) hey, thanks!

Kev
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HUFFPOST BLOGGER
Ellie Slee
12:48 PM on 10/21/2012
Hi Kev,

Thought you might be interested in this. In a study conducted over forty years, it has been proven that:

"Violence against women is a global problem... In Europe it is a bigger danger to women than cancer, with 45 per cent of European women experiencing some form of physical or sexual violence."

Maybe you are more likely to get punched in the street, but this extensive survey basically says that nearly 5 out of every 10 women you meet in the UK will have been beaten or raped by the time she dies. Try not to ridicule girls who are frightened. It doesn't win you any fans.

http://www.awid.org/News-Analysis/Announcements2/Press-Release-Largest-Global-Study-on-Violence-Against-Women-Finds-Feminist-Movements-Hold-the-Key-to-Change#.UH7MGXWg9lU.twitter
11:08 PM on 10/08/2012
Lol sorry there was a time when concern for another would have been seen as chivalry from a lady. Rather you should question why that has changed so much? Huh... k the first was obviously insulted that his mothers love hadn’t rubbed off on you, n frankly dear that was a very arseholy thing u were guilty of there. fair enough the aston guy sounded a nonce but it was raining! You ungrateful little madame.. the other guy did sound drunk n we all know what they’re like. but as you were not actually assaulted, (and less than half as likely as a guy) Don’t you just think, that you were in-fact only a ‘victim’ of your own fear. Don’t blame anyone else for that. it solves nothing..

Its sad to think the state of the world, or rather feminine society when concern is met with such contempt.. Isn’t that 'concrete fact' the very reason they gave two ducks about u? as u said no-one gets laid from helping someone once. Or is that how you feed your ego, worm. oh but don’t worry luv, one day you may Actually receive it back..

good day miss.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
DJPotterWriter
05:41 PM on 10/08/2012
The first two sound odd. The third sounds like a not-very-unusual drunk person, not necessarily someone looking for female companionship.

On the issue of romantic relations, I've been thinking, perhaps it would be easier, if men and women were to switch roles, i.e. if women would be the ones who 99% of the time make the first move, do the asking-out, etc. Since men seem to find women less offensive than women find men (that's not meant as a criticism of men or of women, just an observation), perhaps such a change would lead to greater harmony between the sexes.
02:22 PM on 10/08/2012
What worries me is that, not only do you realise that your comment will be offensive to some people (and yet post it anyway, lest you miss out on that all important stranger sex), but you give yourself a ready-made instant dismissal of any dissent you may receive. No, you have not justified anything illegal (immoral is a much more nebulous term, but I am willing to believe that your intent is not to harm anyone), just as I have not given an 'emotional crazy response' (way to gender stereotype, by the way! Remember that cultural vacuum!). What I have given is a rational response that is perhaps tinged by personal experience. I acknowledge that, but I do not accept that an aspect of subjectivity renders my arguments in any way invalid, especially since we are discussing the subjective experiences of 50% of the population.

Wow, apologies for how long and convoluted that all was.
02:21 PM on 10/08/2012
In any case, always, ALWAYS be aware that by approaching a stranger of any gender, you are encroaching on their space and time and if you are in any doubt that you are not 100% welcome, back off immediately. You have no 'right' to their time, conversation or anything else. Secondly, the prospect of a woman being approached in a club, say, is actually very different from your suggestion of approaching someone in a supermarket. People do not go to the supermarket hoping to be propositioned for sex by a stranger and, frankly, I cannot ever see this being anything more than objectifying, disrespectful and displaying an unattractive lack of concern for social convention or personal boundaries.
02:19 PM on 10/08/2012
Doubtless:
The question is most definitely not 'what is an appropriate way for men to approach women in this way'. I cannot emphasise enough how little that is an appropriate question to be asking when discussing late night street harassment, because asking it suggests that you are more concerned with whether or not you have the chance to get laid by a stranger than you are with whether women feel safe when walking alone. Even so, I'm going to answer your question, so that everyone can STOP ASKING IT!
Of course every woman has different levels of comfort with being approached for sex by strangers. This is because every woman has different experiences of sexism, objectification and abuse. As far as many women are concerned, the risk of making someone (justifiably, and often highly) uncomfortable is too high to justify ever approaching anyone. I have quite a lot to say on the subject of whether approaching any stranger for sex is ever OK, but for now I'll be as brief as I can about when, if ever, it is acceptable (and some women will think it is). Just remember that the risk of you missing out on potential sex with a stranger is not, ultimately, as important as women feeling safe and comfortable in public, and that nothing you do exists in a cultural vacuum.
This comment has been removed.
02:17 PM on 10/08/2012
librarianesque:
There is a direct contradiction in your advice to 'not get upset or irritated...deal with it and move on' and your advice to 'be aware of your surroundings and mind your safety'. The fact is that street harassment is a symptom of the same attitudes and culture that leads to attacks and rape. Clearly, all these men thought they had enough ownership a stranger's time that they felt that had the right to approach her at 1am on a dangerous street - however unlikely (and it's actually not as unlikely as many people like to think), there is still the possibility that any one of them may have also felt enough ownership over a strange woman that they felt they had the right to sexually assault her (to say nothing of the risk of mugging, etc.). If a woman is to 'be aware of [her] surroundings and mind [her] safety', it is impossible that she simply accept this sort of behaviour.
In response to your 'boys will be boys' remark, please see my response to maddogmosher.
01:51 PM on 10/08/2012
One of the things that worries me most about this article is that the comments below all seem more preoccupied with either dismissing these men's actions as inevitable and natural (and therefore the writer's reactions as oversensitive), or with derailing the conversation into a how-to on when it is appropriate to try and solicit strangers for sex. I'm not surprised, but I am disappointed so I thought I'd post my responses to each comment. I don't mean for any of the commenters to feel like I'm singling them out or be offended, I'm just sick of these being the go-to responses to street harassment.

maddogmosher:
I think men with no sense, manners or decency will be part of the human condition as long as we allow them to be. Saying this sort of behaviour is inevitable is simply tacit acceptance of it.
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librarianesque
The Right was Wrong, the Left was Right.
11:04 AM on 10/08/2012
...And here I was thinking English (or, at least men in Britain) are reserved when it comes to the fairer sex! In my very humble opinion, and also speaking as a woman, you seem to be overthinking things. Boys'll be boys. There's no reason for you to get upset or irritated when they approach you, even if it is when you prefer that they wouldn't. That's life, move past it and learn how to deal. Just be aware of your surroundings and mind your safety. I believe you were trying to make a greater point about the brutalization of women...but it didn't come until your last sentence. Perhaps you should have expanded upon that.
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maddogmosher
Ignorance is the biggest threat to democracy
10:55 AM on 10/08/2012
Men with no manners, decency or sense unfortunately have always been part of the human condition.