George Conway, a conservative attorney, and CNN senior legal analyst Elie Honig got into a lively debate on Wednesday about the Colorado Supreme Court’s decision to bar Donald Trump from the state’s presidential primary ballots.
After the news broke last week, Conway wrote in an article for The Atlantic that he had been unconvinced about the strength of the argument to disqualify Trump under Section 3 of the 14th Amendment, but changed his mind after reading the three dissenting opinions, which he said “were gobsmacking—for their weakness.”
Honig, on the other hand, has disagreed with elements of the 4-3 ruling. He argued that it violates the former president’s due process rights and said he believes it will be overturned by the US Supreme Court.
Section 3 of the 14th Amendment says that nobody can “hold any office” in the US if they had previously taken an oath to support the Constitution and then “engaged in insurrection or rebellion.”
On Wednesday, however, Honig argued that another section of the 14th Amendment muddies the waters.
“Section 5, two sections ahead, says Congress shall have the power to pass legislation to enact this amendment. So has Congress done that? No. It doesn’t say Congress shall have the power or states can,” he said.
In response, Conway argued that the insurrection clause is self-executing, echoing other prominent law experts.
“If Section 3 says somebody who’s engaged in an insurrection is not eligible if they’ve already taken an oath, then that’s what it means,” he said. “You don’t need Congress to tell you to follow the Constitution.”
Honig pushed back, but Conway interrupted: “Elie. Elie. Elie. You know better.”
“It’s nonsense, Elie. It’s not an argument,” he added, as they both spoke over each other to be heard.
It kept getting more spirited from there, with Honig at one point accusing Conway of “pretzel logic.”
Watch the debate below.
Colorado’s decision hinges on Trump’s role in the Jan. 6, 2021, insurrection on the U.S. Capitol after he fed his supporters lies that the 2020 election was stolen.
The Colorado Republican Party has asked the U.S. Supreme Court to intervene following the state court’s decision. Trump has also said he intends to appeal the ruling himself.